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  1. #1
    Get off my lawn.
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    Oct 2006
    Winston Salem, NC
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    OFFICIAL Brake Ultra-Sticky Supreme 9000


    Those Poor Rotors! (Crossdrilling, Slotting, Cryo-treating, etc)

    The "Warped" Brake Disc and Other Myths of the Braking System


    How to Choose the Best Street and Track Brake Pads

    What pads are available to us/where can they be purchased?

    Saturn Front Pads
    Hawk HPS: HB409F.661
    EBC Greenstuffxxxxxxxxxxxx
    EBC Redstuffxxxxxxxxxxxx

    Saturn Rear Pads
    Hawk HPS: HB359F.543
    EBC Greenstuffxxxxxxxxxxxx
    EBC Redstuffxxxxxxxxxxxx

    Mitsubishi Eclipse Front Pads
    Hawk HPS: HB213F.626
    Hawk HP+: HB213N.626
    Hawk Blue: HB213E.626
    Carbotech AX6xxxxxxxxxxxx
    Carbotech XP8xxxxxxxxxxxx
    Carbotech XP10xxxxxxxxxxxx
    Porterfield R4xxxxxxxxxxxx
    Porterfield R41xxxxxxxxxxxx
    Porterfield R4Exxxxxxxxxxxx
    Porterfield R4Sxxxxxxxxxxxx

    Modifying the Mitsubishi Eclipse pad to fit
    *Note that this opens up pad options quite a bit. Front pads for a 1995 Eclipse GST will all work with the slight mods shown above. Most of the big pad manufacturers (Hawk, Carbotech, Porterfield, Etc.) have a full range of pads available (street, race, enduro) for this car.

    Upgrades and Brake Kits

    Brake Engineering Basics



    Auto Gear Racing

    OE Rear Disc conversion

    Can I use Drum brake lines with my rear discs?

    SS Brake lines

    Rear Brake Upgrades - is Bigger Really Better?

    Cooling Ducts

    Changing Master Cylinder Size


    Front Brake Job

    Rear Brake Job

    Parking Brake Adjustment

    How to Bleed Brakes - The Right Way

    Bleeding Brakes With One-Person Brake Bleeder

    Stoptech Brake Bedding FAQ
    *Note that different pad manufacturers have different recommendations for brake pad bedding.
    *Please follow the manufacturer's instructions for your pads.

    Replace Hard Lines

    Bleeding the ABS System

    Additional Information

    The Team scR tech articles are full of good info:

    James Walker Jr. of Team scR (also writes articles for StopTech and Grassroots Motorsports) has a book that covers 95% of what you need to know about braking systems in sports cars:
    High-Performance Brake Systems: Design, Selection, and Installation
    Last edited by Natedogg; 06-21-2013 at 03:32 PM.

  2. #2
    Get off my lawn.
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    Oct 2006
    Winston Salem, NC
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    Re: The Brake Ultra-Sticky Supreme 9000

    How to Bleed ABS Brakes, Method 1

    Read the whole article, but I'll give you the important part:

    But what if I donít have the service tool?

    If you need to cycle the valves, but do not have access to a service tool (or if the retailer is not willing to loan theirs,) you COULD just replace Step #2 above with "go driving and slam on the brakes a few times to make the ABS work" to purge the fluid. This is usually NOT the most efficient or socially responsible solution (though it seems to work just as well). You still need to bleed the car a second time, but it saves you from procuring the service tool.
    How to Bleed ABS Brakes, Method 2

    In the past, I have used a pressure bleeder to bleed my brake system at the calipers, but I have never bled the system at the ABS control module assembly. I specifically recall that after my first brake bleed with a vacuum bleeder, the pedal got softer and has never firmed up completely despite numerous pressure bleeds. So, I'm guessing that I somehow introduced into the ABS control module during that first brake bleed.

    I learned that the older Saturns used a GM Delphi VI ABS System. The main concern by wolfman and other well-respected members of this forum was that the pistons may not be in the home position after vehicle shutdown, hence the need for the scan tool to ensure a proper bleed. However, I recalled reading somewhere that older Delphi ABS systems can be properly bled without a scan tool, so I decided to do a bit more research.

    Based on my research, I have learned that the scan tool is not absolutely necessary as the pistons always stay in the home position following an ABS initialization as long as no ABS activation events have occurred. In addition, based on what I've read, you will not get fluid flow from the rear calipers if the pistons are not in the home position, which is something that I have never had a problem with. However, as stated in the instructions, you must first bleed the ABS control module at the front/rear bleed screws AND at the outgoing lines BEFORE bleeding the system at the calipers. Since I have only been bleeding the system at the calipers, this may very well explain why I still have a soft pedal!

    Here are the service instructions that I have found on the Delphi VI ABS system, courtesy of a textbook:
    Delphi Chassis (Delco Moraine) ABS-VI.: To bleed the ABS-VI system, the pistons in the front and rear modulators must be in their upper positions to unseat the check balls in the hydraulic circuits. GM recommends using a scan tool with bidirectional control to do this. Although a scan tool makes the job faster and easier, the pistons can be positioned manually.

    To manually position the modulator pistons, start the engine and run it for 10 seconds. Verify that the ABS lamp is off and listen for several sharp clicks that indicate the pistons being driven to their upper positions. If you do not hear these distinct clicks, drive the car at 5 mph and again listen for the clicking of the ABS control motors. When you hear the clicks, carefully drive the car to the service bay without activating ABS operation.

    Before bleeding the wheel brakes, attach a hose to the rear bleeder screw on the hydraulic modulator (closest to the master cylinder) and manually bleed all air from the bleeder port (Figure 9-5). Then repeat this procedure at the forward bleeder screw. After bleeding the modulator, loosen all of the brake line fittings on the outboard side of the modulator and manually bleed air from the upper ends of the brake lines (Figure 9-6).

    The last stage of bleeding an ABS-VI system is to bleed the wheel brakes, either manually or with pressure equipment. Because of the variations in ABS-VI installations and because the system has been split either diagonally or front to rear on different vehicles, consult the carmakerís service instructions for the specific wheel bleeding sequence.

    See pp. 8 and 9 for the pictures:

  3. #3
    6S Moderator Natedogg's Avatar
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    Nov 2005
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    What do I REALLY need to do a rear disc conversion?

    Rear calipers
    Rear caliper brackets
    Caliper slider bolts and bracket-to-knuckle bolts as well as the anti-squeal clips
    Rear caliper e-brake cables
    Rear brake discs
    Rear brake pads

    If your knuckles have a ton of rust built up on the caliper bracket mounting surface, remove the rust. If it is uneven either true it up or get new knuckles. You don't want the calipers riding the least bit crooked on the rotors.

    What don't I really need?:

    You don't have to use the rear splash shields if you don't want to.

    You DO NOT need rear hubs from a rear disc vehicle.
    Current: 2015 Fiesta ST - Full stage 3 bolt-ons and a 93 octane custom Stratified tune at 27 PSI.

    Former modded N/A 97 SL2, unmolested 96 SC2, and turbo 95 SL2.
    99' SL2 Turbo - Parted out, returned to stock years ago, still on the road but everything keeps breaking.
    00' SC2 DD - SOLD
    02' SL1 - On loan to someone

  4. #4
    6S Moderator S.Bretz's Avatar
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    Apr 2004
    Lutz, Fl
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnny95sl2 View Post
    Non ABS
    No picture so ill try and explain.

    Looking at ports

    Top Left=Left front nut size M12x1.0
    Bottom left= Right rear Nut size M10x1.0
    Top right=right front M11x1.5
    Bottom right=Left rear M13x1.5

    Left to right
    Left front M10x1.0
    Right rear M11x1.5
    Left rear M10x1.0
    Right front M11x1.5

    The brake lines are a little larger than a standard 3/16. The size difference is not enough to affect using the metric fittings.
    -6S Resident Mechanical Forensics member #001.
    1995 SC2 Turbo 3.6L DOHC, 6sp manual, Ford 8.8 rearend running on MS3x.
    1998 F-250 5.4L triton...stock.

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