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  1. #1
    Approved Vendor ZombieSatty's Avatar
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    Giving the Zombie a new brain. (Standalone content)

    *Comtinued from Facebook discussion,https://m.facebook.com/groups/141947...88764381353663

    So I'm going to commit to this so I can't talk myself out of it. Just need to decide on which Megasquirt and accessories to get. Might try electromotive if Brett can convince me. For now, MS it is. This thread is as much my brainstorming as it is planning and asking questions.

    What all options do I need to nail down? My hopeful, ideal plan is as little downtime as possible and to keep it very much DD status. I'll add criteria and goals here as I think of it.

    -I'll build it myself, because I can and want to. Should be cheaper as well. So that limits me to MS2 base correct?

    -I'll jump in whole hog and do fuel/spark.

    -boost ready with GM 2 bar MAP in stock location.

    -IAC control, stock valve or otherwise. That Jeep PWM seems easy enough.

    -retain AC, I'm too old for no AC, and I intend to keep it as a DD.

    -Do I need to bother switching to returnless fuel now? Don't see why atm.

    -The plan I'm thinking up is to use the/a stock harness > a set of PCM connectors > breakout from there to MS and PCM at first. That way I can go right back to stock control with just a few connections. Go easy and let PCM run gauges etc at first.

    -If I can set it up right, the eventual plan will be to put the MS boards in a stock PCM case. Because stealth. Eventually I would like to ditch the PCM totally and have the MS run the whole show.

    What else do I need to decide on? I know I need to read up and get a shopping list going.
    It's not my fault, blame the radiation.

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  3. #2
    HNIC SC2Sick's Avatar
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    I got a second set of injector wires and made it so I can just switch the wires back and forth under the hood. Being able to run the megasquirt in parallel gives you many additional troubleshooting options when you need them
    Sixthsphere.com Owner
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  5. #3
    Approved Vendor ZombieSatty's Avatar
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    Just added a connection set? If it's a good idea, that is easy enough.
    It's not my fault, blame the radiation.

  6. #4
    HNIC SC2Sick's Avatar
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    Yeah. Same for spark if you're going to use stock ignition components. Just make another harness with a junkyard connector and tuck it away. It'll blend in with little work.
    Sixthsphere.com Owner
    2016 Honda Fit
    2003 BMW e46
    2001 Saturn SC2 - Forged with everything but boost - FOR SALE PM FOR MORE INFO
    1998 Ford Ranger

  7. #5
    siris's Avatar
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    That's a good idea Tony, I hadn't thought of creating a stand alone harness.

    As far as controlling the stock guages I have a little insight on how they work, but can't remember the hard numbers right now, I'd have to look at my Arduino program.

    I don't think the MS2 would be happy running the car and guages, I don't think it has enough outputs/software requirements, so if that's your ultimate goal I would go with a MS3. It's been a while since I have done research on all the MS stuff so theres alot I've forgotten.

    If you are running the stock PCM to run guages and want something you can conceal pretty easily, a microsquirt should work for you, especially if running a 2 bar map and obd1 ignition. It just won't be able to run your guages.
    72 Charger: pissed me off, on jackstands.
    95 SW1m: Dohc swap. DD. I can haz boost?

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  9. #6

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    isn't there something from Dakota digi that will run our speedo when get rid of the stock pcm? I'm going electromotive on my dd first to learn how to tune so I don't blow up my turbo build. The electromotive just seems like less of a headache, and at the end of the day its about how much your times worth to you. I'm considering gutting a cluster and just putting in all aftermarket gauges.

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  11. #7
    siris's Avatar
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    Our speedo uses a funky pulse per mile scheme. Without looking at my boost controller's program I cant remember exactly, but I want to say it was 5000pulses per mile.
    72 Charger: pissed me off, on jackstands.
    95 SW1m: Dohc swap. DD. I can haz boost?

  12. #8
    Resident Electromotive Expert importsdontlikeme's Avatar
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    IIRC Craig's dad used a Dakota digital unit on the speedo for his TDI build.
    @dwillimon happy that you chose electromotive sir. You won't be disappointed.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

    Interested in a solid engine management system? Ask me about Electromotive engine management.

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  14. #9
    Approved Vendor ZombieSatty's Avatar
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    Advantage of fancy crank tooth trigger signal vs stock CPS? More detailed/accurate? With noise suppression on CPS, is there much difference? MS can go either way, TecS wants crank trigger wheel.
    It's not my fault, blame the radiation.

  15. #10
    HNIC SC2Sick's Avatar
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    Higher resolution. I haven't found a benefit I'm missing yet personally, at least a present.
    Sixthsphere.com Owner
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    2001 Saturn SC2 - Forged with everything but boost - FOR SALE PM FOR MORE INFO
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  16. #11
    Resident Electromotive Expert importsdontlikeme's Avatar
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    Higher resolution is the answer like Tony said. The end goal is firing the spark plugs at the exact time they should be fired. Under rapid engine acceleration this is critical. Electromotive invented the 60-2 trigger 30+ years ago and their TEC systems are designed around it that's why the lead the industry with ignition timing.


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    Interested in a solid engine management system? Ask me about Electromotive engine management.

  17. #12
    Approved Vendor ZombieSatty's Avatar
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    Can MS take enough advantage of this to be worth it? If CPS going to work 90% as well. You all know there are a few places i can make more than 10%.
    It's not my fault, blame the radiation.

  18. #13
    Resident Electromotive Expert importsdontlikeme's Avatar
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    I'm not an electrical engineer however, it was explained to me in the jack of all trades vs master mechanic argument.

    MS was not designed solely around the 60-2 therefore it is not as equipped to properly gather all of that information coming off the trigger wheel. The advantages of a 60-2 on MS are minimal it has actually been argued that systems not designed for the 60-2 trigger will operate better with a lesser trigger because they simply can't process that many triggers per sec.

    You will notice a significant increase in throttle response on the electromotive system due to how quickly the ignition timing can stay exactly where it belongs under rapid engine acceleration.

    In short when you set it at 30* advance it will stay there no mater how quickly the engine is changing RPM.


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  19. #14

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    Im personally sold on the ease of install and lack of headache of electromotive. Im building a harness from the parts car so that I don't have to gut my car and be without transportation. How many threads do we have on here trouble shooting ms? There seems to be a lot, in fact that's what has put me off from running a stand alone for so long. Im not saying ms doesn't work, it seems to work well once all the bugs are chased out of it. If this is your dd then downtime is something to take into consideration.

  20. #15
    Resident Electromotive Expert importsdontlikeme's Avatar
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    The ease of install and tuning is really straightforward with EM however, electromotive is known for performance and at the end of the day isn't that why we install standalone systems?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

    Interested in a solid engine management system? Ask me about Electromotive engine management.

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  22. #16
    Yerboogieman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZombieSatty View Post
    *Comtinued from Facebook discussion,https://m.facebook.com/groups/141947...88764381353663

    So I'm going to commit to this so I can't talk myself out of it. Just need to decide on which Megasquirt and accessories to get. Might try electromotive if Brett can convince me. For now, MS it is. This thread is as much my brainstorming as it is planning and asking questions.

    What all options do I need to nail down? My hopeful, ideal plan is as little downtime as possible and to keep it very much DD status. I'll add criteria and goals here as I think of it.

    -I'll build it myself, because I can and want to. Should be cheaper as well. So that limits me to MS2 base correct?

    -I'll jump in whole hog and do fuel/spark.

    -boost ready with GM 2 bar MAP in stock location.

    -IAC control, stock valve or otherwise. That Jeep PWM seems easy enough.

    -retain AC, I'm too old for no AC, and I intend to keep it as a DD.

    -Do I need to bother switching to returnless fuel now? Don't see why atm.

    -The plan I'm thinking up is to use the/a stock harness > a set of PCM connectors > breakout from there to MS and PCM at first. That way I can go right back to stock control with just a few connections. Go easy and let PCM run gauges etc at first.

    -If I can set it up right, the eventual plan will be to put the MS boards in a stock PCM case. Because stealth. Eventually I would like to ditch the PCM totally and have the MS run the whole show.

    What else do I need to decide on? I know I need to read up and get a shopping list going.
    Stock PCM makes a great enclosure. You can even desolder the stock connectors from the board and use those if you have the time to put in the effort.

    Sent from my SM-G386T using Tapatalk
    Beige 93 SC2, fully loaded, MS3 Pro, 150 shot nitrous, Walbro 255, high compression. 155hp/296hp
    Purple 93 SC2, Minus all options, save for rear discs. Formerly turbocharged with a GT25R and forged internals. MS2. 390hp (150mph club )
    99 SC2 M/T 206k, 97 SC2 M/T 106k

    If you don't have the time to do it right, when will you have the time to do it over?

  23. Likes ZombieSatty liked this post
  24. #17
    siris's Avatar
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    That's how I made my wiring harness for the fic. Took an old pcm and salvaged the female plug, then took a male harness and soldered the two together. Huge pain in the ass to desolder the female pcm connector in my opinion. Felt like it took FOREVER.
    72 Charger: pissed me off, on jackstands.
    95 SW1m: Dohc swap. DD. I can haz boost?

  25. Likes ZombieSatty liked this post
  26. #18
    Approved Vendor ZombieSatty's Avatar
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    Thanks guys, I knew I am not the only one to go this route. I have access to a hot air soldering station and electronics assembly stuff at work. Should make pretty quick work of it all. I'll be eating quick lunches for a while once I start building this
    It's not my fault, blame the radiation.

  27. #19
    6S Moderator S.Bretz's Avatar
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    If you go with an MS2 then you don't need to worry about getting a GM 2 bar sensor, the stock MS'2 have come with a 2.5bar for years....just run a hose to it from the intake manifold and you are good to go.
    -6S Resident Mechanical Forensics member #001.
    1995 SC2 Turbo 3.6L DOHC, 6sp manual, Ford 8.8 rearend running on MS3x.
    1998 F-250 5.4L triton...stock.

  28. #20
    Approved Vendor ZombieSatty's Avatar
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    Understood, buy If it will keep an extra hose out of the equation, I'll just get the new sensor.

    Besides buying a new sensor, the only other downside i can think of right off is those extra connections to the board. It will take up one of my free IO ports, right? Or is it already designated?
    Last edited by ZombieSatty; 02-23-2017 at 07:36 AM.
    It's not my fault, blame the radiation.

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